Chris Grainger: 0:53

Welcome to the Lion Within Us, a podcast serving Christian men who are hungry to be the leaders God intends you to be. I'm your host, chris Granger. Let's jump in. All right, fellas, this is your meat episode. Let's get right into it, okay. So the scripture of the week this week is out of the book of Galatians, the sixth chapter, the second verse. It says carry each other's burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ. Love that verse. Guys. If you missed the spiritual kickoff episode, just go back one of your podcast feed and, as a reminder, we do the spiritual kickoff Monday through Friday at the Lion Within Us. It's free. It's our way to serve, to give to others. So head over to thelionwithinus, click on that daily spiritual kickoff and get started today. So this conversation is going to be a going fellas.

Chris Grainger: 1:39

We brought in Roy Wooten. He is the executive director of the crucible project, so you may have heard of this before. So the crucible project is out there, they're they're serving in a very meaningful way, with with encounters, with getaways, with weekends, and Roy has a wonderful background. He was a pastor, he was a ministry executive, he was a coach, he was a counselor and really all those experiences preparing him for this opportunity to serve in this capacity. He's speaking to thousands of men and women worldwide, so he's a frequent speaker. We talk about this a little bit today on biblical manhood, marriage, fatherhood. He's written several books. We unpacked this one that is called Unstuck, so we do talk about that a little bit. And just a great guy out of Texas, a Texan, out there, we talk a little bit about Texas. Have some fun with that as well. So hopefully you guys enjoy this conversation with Roy Wooten. All right, roy, welcome to the Line Within Us. How are you doing today?

Roy Wooten: 2:50

Doing well. I'm thankful for this opportunity to be with you and any chance I get to speak to men around men's issues, I'm excited to do that. So very thankful for what you're doing, what God's doing through you.

Chris Grainger: 3:03

Amen, brother, amen. Well, looking forward to this one for sure, and before we get into the nuts and bolts and the heart of what we're hopefully going to be talking about, share something fun about you, maybe, roy, that not many people know about.

Roy Wooten: 3:19

I always just like to start off a little bit light. So what's a fun fact about Roy? Well, one of the fun facts about me is that I played football in Texas, which is a big deal. I loved baseball, but because I had some athletic ability, the whole town pushed me into football. Okay, and while I was playing football on that team, a guy came and hung out with us and the team after us and then wrote a book called Friday Night Lights. They became the movie Friday Night Lights. So that's a fun little fact about me.

Chris Grainger: 3:46

There you go. That's pretty cool, that's awesome. So football on Friday night in Texas so you got to. You got to experience that firsthand on Friday night in Texas, so you got to experience that firsthand.

Roy Wooten: 3:55

Yeah, so back in the pre-concussion protocol days. So you know I have some drain damage from it. You know, every time I can't remember a name or something. You know, that's what I blame it on. I love it, I love it. Learned a lot about leadership through playing high school sports.

Chris Grainger: 4:19

Okay, Well, you definitely get a lot of life lessons there, for sure. Well, I know we got connected on several of your projects that you're working on primarily the Crucible Project and I just wanted to kind of give you an opportunity to share the genesis of that, what led to starting that and how you guys go about serving people out there.

Roy Wooten: 4:41

Sure. Thanks, chris. Well, greg Houston was a longtime pastor in the inner cities Cleveland and then Chicago and he was struggling, what he says, with things going on in the basement of his life. They were getting in the way of his relationship with God, with his wife and with his daughters. He's got daughters, he's a girl dad and he went to Christian counselors. He went to all the men's stuff out there. He went to a number of different, read every book that he could trying to get at that, and one of the Christian counselors sent him to a secular weekend that really opened him up and he found what he says grace that he had never experienced in the church on that weekend he was so impressed with the things that tied into the Bible on the weekend he said I want to bring this to Christian men all over the world. And so our founder started the first weekend in 2001. And in 2005, we formed as a ministry called the Crucible Project and we've been running ever since. So this year we'll do 60 retreats in 16 locations in the US and four other countries, three continents. So God's blessed us and using us.

Roy Wooten: 6:13

And yeah, I was out in Houston, texas, running show bearer counseling centers. We had more than a couple of dozen counselors in seven locations in the greater Houston area wonderful ministry and my brother-in-law called and said you know how Promise Keepers was like a mile wide and an inch deep. He said the Crucible Project is they're doing something really unique for men and they're more like a mile deep. So they have these weekends that are really challenging and you got to come check it out. So I went to check it out and while I was there, it was amazing how, within the first hour or two of being on property, god already started dealing with me about some things that happened a long time ago in my childhood that I thought I'd kind of taken care of. It's behind me, I've dealt with it. However, you want to say that, but what I experienced on the weekend moved me from a place of knowing that I'm saved and that I'm going to heaven to really believe in it in every cell in my body and in my heart and in my head. In my body and in my heart and in my head and as a longtime minister and pastor and leader of Christian ministries, it was a big aha for me. It was wonderful, and I was sitting next to in the room with some guys who are struggling with, you know, wanting to achieve more in their life, with men who were running in circles around compulsive, you know, masturbation and pornography. And men Christian men who were, you know, at church every Sunday, even in leadership roles, but also had anger outbursts that would scare their children and their families, their wives, and these things were just popping within them and it didn't matter. The thing that so impressed me was it didn't matter why they came or what they were really challenged with in their life. They got some healing that helped them walk out of there in a different way. And I told the founder that I was speaking of Greg Houston. I had lunch with him on Sunday of the weekend and I said I want every man in my life to get to taste what I tasted here. It's incredible, how can I get all of the men in my life to do this? And within a short year or so, we began hosting these weekends in Houston, texas. So that's kind of how we moved and how we've grown. It's amazing.

Roy Wooten: 9:12

I think most people at that time in my life would have said Roy's successful. He has a wife that adores him, he has children that are well-behaved and he's doing well for himself. But about two weeks after the weekend my wife said I feel like I got the husband that I married back. So there was something that happened on the weekend that had, I know me, more connected with my head and heart in such a way that it was she was feeling it, she was sensing it and drawn to me the way she was in our early years of marriage.

Roy Wooten: 9:55

I think I was about 20 years in to marriage at that time. So I've become an advocate and eventually volunteered for five years amidst leading the ministry I led there in Houston and then eventually started leading some of the weekends and just before COVID felt called to step into the role that they were calling me to, to lead the ministry and it's been a great adventure through COVID and all of that and then to keep us going and then to see how God's using us. And then to see how God's using us we impacted close to a thousand souls last year in. These really go deep retreats.

Chris Grainger: 10:42

And you said they're weekend type retreats. I'm assuming there's destination type areas that guys are traveling to and do they know it? Do they come as groups? So is it individuals? How does that typically work?

Roy Wooten: 10:54

Yeah, typically it's one person. Whenever I went, I grabbed some guys that were around me in my life and I said, hey, I'm going to go do this. It sounds challenging, do you want to go? And so I ended up with five of my friends on my weekend mostly that it's individuals who come because it's a very important process of taking a hard look at yourself right Beginning Friday night when you arrive at 7 pm for our weekend.

Roy Wooten: 11:28

We have a series of experiences meant to help you look at how your life is and what are the things that you're putting in the way between you and the man you want to be, the man that God's called you to be. What are the things that you have blocking you, that you've put there, that you've allowed through your choices. You've allowed Satan to put there between you and God, and you and your spouse, if you're married, you and your children, if you're a parent, and just between you and the man that you want to be. So it's a heavy push down. We believe in strong integrity, and integrity meaning that we keep our word. We make agreements that are clear and we always keep those agreements. We believe that the choices you make have led to the life that you are living in and around that, that it's important to find a place to stand and take responsibility for the life that you're in, in other words, to stop blaming and complaining and to move into a place of power and responsibility, to actually do something different, to make different choices, so that you can get the life that you really want. And along the path we give men an opportunity to get real with each other, to be authentic.

Roy Wooten: 13:00

One of the things that I'm sad about is how many men are living in isolation. It's a holy discontent of mine that three out of five men can't name five or more friends and one out of five can't name a single friend. I mean, think about this, chris you go to the grocery store or out to eat or to the lumberyard and you're looking around and every fifth guy might not even have a friend in his life. And I think it also happens within the church, where we have these surface relationships. We have these. You know, we'll talk about the weather and we'll talk about sports, we might say a prayer request about a health concern, sometimes about something work related, but mainly we keep all this real stuff hidden. We don't say, yeah, I'm really struggling. I don't know if I'm a good father. You know, my son came home 12 years old and smelled like pot last week. I just don't know what to do. And you know, do I power up? What do I do with him? And so we go through life isolated, not really letting people know what's going on inside of us.

Roy Wooten: 14:12

And James 5.16 says to confess your sins one to another for healing, and the prayer of a righteous man availeth much. So. There is something powerful about confession that most evangelical churches are leaving on the table for people. And so we'll go through life shallow, disconnected, and we might say we have a friend or two or five, but they're at a distance. And Satan tells us two lies that we buy into. You're the only one struggling with this, which is nonsense. And number two, brother, if you're listening right now, this is for you, that you, you have to figure it out on your own, that you've got to figure it out on your own. And those two are lies right, yeah.

Roy Wooten: 15:02

And so we really give, create opportunities through our series of experiences, for men to get real with each other about all the things that's coming up for them in the you know, as they've taken a hard look at their life Right and, and, and so it's in that, it's in that that God is using us powerfully.

Chris Grainger: 15:25

That is really cool. So on the experience level, I'm just super curious Are some of these physical type of activities that will push you to some degree? I'm sure it's not like a boot camp where you're just actually doing pushups in the mud and things like that, but there's probably, with guys there, there's an element of we got to do some hard things here.

Roy Wooten: 15:48

Yes, so we do. We do believe that just sitting around listening to more information is not the solution. So there is some physicality to our weekend and there's one exercise that is, or you know, one process that has some physical challenge. But the rest of the weekend is really not that physically challenged because we're really working on between the ears and between the head and heart and, instead of taking notes and learning more, we're actually giving you a process so that you can think through and feel into whatever's going on in your life, so that you can do something different about it. So the amount of awareness that we have as humans, doing this heart surgery that Ezekiel talks about, and to really get clean, to really be open and clean, to step into fully the hard work of maturing in my faith even though I might have been a disciple for a long time, I might have been saved in our teens or as a child or somewhere along the way maybe the same guy, just a little older than I was back then as far as my faith development. We are getting at those hard things on our weekend and our analogy is Jacob's story, so if we've got a couple of minutes here, I'll try to unpack it.

Roy Wooten: 17:26

Yeah, so Jacob's story is that he was born into a home where, you know, he was a twin and his dad loved his brother more than him. Scripture says. In fact, his brother was kind of burly, the masculine male. He was out, you know, hunting, and Jacob was in the tents with his mom and I can just imagine the scripture doesn't say it, but that there were some things going on in his head around. Am I a man? Am I good enough? My dad loves him more. Am I even lovable, etc. And with his mom's conniving help, he manipulates his brother out of his birthright, his father out of his blessing, and flees with Esau telling him I'm going to kill you the next time I see you.

Roy Wooten: 18:20

That's right, right. He goes and tries to start all over. Now there's a lot of men who have done that. They're just like I messed up in this first marriage. I've messed up in this thing. I'm going to move to a different place. I'm going to start all over. I'm going to start all over. I'm going to start a new job. I'm going to start a new career. I'm going to get a new family.

Roy Wooten: 18:37

And this is what Jacob does. He goes and works for his father-in-law's business. Laban and him and his brother-in-laws are running this business and over time he starts becoming again a bit manipulative and his brother-in-laws find out and Jacob goes oh no, we've got to get. And he runs again. He's running and hiding the way that so many men do, and it takes them two or three days for Laban and the crew to start chasing them. He takes everything that he has, all his employees that he can, all of all of his assets, and he's run and his family. And and he's run and his family, and he finds himself.

Roy Wooten: 19:17

He hears Jacob's coming with 600 men and he finds himself on the brook of the Jabbok, between the decisions that he made a long time ago and the choices that he made most recently and the consequences of those. And there God meets him and wrestles with him and in the wrestling he says who are you? And he said my name is Jacob. He admits that he's a conniver, deceiver, manipulator. He owns his name given at birth and through the wrestling he fights until God blesses him and in the blessing he's given a new name, a name of Israel.

Roy Wooten: 19:57

That from that moment on, he walked out of that with a different walk. He was limping. He walked out of that with a different walk and in such a way that Jacob didn't kill him but blessed him, and now a whole nation is named after him. Right, his people, people in his heritage, his ancestral relatives, still call themselves Israelites sometimes. So this is a powerful example of what God can do with us. When we get real with him, we stop hiding, we own stuff with him and we dive into the hard work to fight for the blessing.

Chris Grainger: 20:41

Amen. Love the story of Jacob as well. That's a great, great connection there. Guys, we're going to take our first break. We'll come right back with Roy. I've got something big to share.

Chris Grainger: 20:54

We're making a major shift because we know the battle is real and it's time more men had access to the support they need. For too long, guys have been trying to carry the weight alone pressure at work, tension at home, wounds from the past in a world that demands strength but offers no place to rest. We see it, we've lived it, and that's exactly why we built our community. It's a stronghold, a place where warriors can find rest, truth and a band of brothers standing beside them. And starting now, we're making it easier than ever to step in. We've lowered the barrier to just $15.99 a month. That means, for less than the cost of a drive-thru lunch, you can join a brotherhood that's centered on Christ and built for growth. Inside you'll find access to our daily spiritual kickoffs every Monday through Friday, our Lion Lunches, our Bible Studies, our Friday Forge Gatherings all that and so much more.

Chris Grainger: 21:46

Every man needs a stronghold and you don't have to fight alone. If you've been waiting for the right time to jump in, this is it. Go to thelionwithinus and join the community and see for yourself what happens when iron truly sharpens iron. Well, I know part of what you're doing as well. What we're hopeful to touch on today, outside the crucible project, is this brand new book you have unstuck and and I really would hope that you give it just a breakdown of what led you to to putting that together. It looks like a great resource, particularly for fathers out there thank you so much.

Roy Wooten: 22:23

Yeah, um yeah, I produce a weekly devotional we call it Compass Resources and I was just taking the things that were most, you know, most showing up in the men that we were working on and writing articles to address those and within a short period of time over six months or so Unstuck started to kind of reveal itself out of it, this idea that most of what is keeping us in the same place in our lives not having the discussion with our boss around our career, not stepping away from corporate America to launch the thing we feel like God's calling us to launch in our business, not having the marriage that we want because we won't have the hard conversations with our wives Most of what's in the way is because we're stuck and it's based in fear. There's fear that if I act and I do whatever it is that I feel like I want to do I really want in my heart, but I'm scared to do that something bad is going to happen. And not only is something bad going to happen, but the things that I've been doing. Instead of doing the thing that I'm afraid of, I'm actually getting something out of those things, and so I would have to give up something in order to go. So fear is in the way and then also I have a pull away from it and in the middle of being stuck, we can get familiar with the stuckness so that it becomes our new norm. Right, it's comfortable for us and we can live in this space and we don't like it. It's not where we want to be, but it's our normal.

Roy Wooten: 24:23

And there are a lot of guys who are stuck in their lives in a number of different areas of their life. It might be a pattern of behavior that you don't want to do, but you find yourself, you continue to do. It might be some aspirational thing that you just have never taken the step to do. I remember when I wrote my first book, you know, 15 years ago, that big fear of launching and going and doing and pushing the button to send it out. You know, moving through the fear Look, begin unstuck takes finding your courage, which means there's not it doesn't mean there's no fear. You got to find the lion within, right, so that you can face the fear and go through it and go ahead and take the action anyway, and really God, over and over in scripture, blesses action. It's when we, it's not when we made the decision. It's whenever we get into action on it that all of a sudden the blessings come Right.

Roy Wooten: 25:26

And I, you know I have a story in my head that somewhere along the way, chris, you felt the calling to launch this podcast right, and you had to get through some of your own blocks to actually go and do it. Like there's got to be somebody else better than me to do this. Or you know, I'm like Moses, I don't speak very well, and you know all of these excuses, and so the book is about getting at that, and you can't get off of it unless you really do some investigation in identity. So many men live with you know all of the lies from Satan that he just kind of whispered in a moment in their life You're not good enough, you don't have what it takes, you're not lovable, you're not worthy, you're not a real man, you're defective, you're broken, etc. But Scripture is very different about what they say about us, and maturing in your faith is continuing to move from the lies that run in your head, that keep you from being all that God's called you to be, to not only discovering but also believing and living out of the things that God says is true about you. Like you are valuable, you are worthy. I take delight in you, he says in the psalm. And so getting that identity is a core thing.

Roy Wooten: 26:53

And so much of our identity problems are tied to our wounds. Chris, back in our childhood, our teen years, where something big or something small happened, where Satan first whispered that that lie, that you're not good enough or whatever. And the way God made our brains is, you know, to look for things that might be risky to us, things that might be dangerous to us. God built us that way. Fear is God-given, is what I'm saying. Fear in and of itself is God-given. Living in a spirit of fear is not.

Roy Wooten: 27:34

Paul tells Timothy I didn't give you a spirit of fear, I gave you a spirit of power.

Roy Wooten: 27:39

And so you know, a little boy goes through life, has some wounds along the way, decides that he's not good enough, and then he starts looking for evidence that that's true, is this true about me? And he can easily find it. Satan shows up with it and by the time he's 20, he already believes that that's true about him and living unaware of how that belief that he's living with was getting in the way of him, you know and impacting everything, that he's doing everything, and we believe that, in order to get at that identity, you've got to go back into the pain, back into the pain, and when you get a chance to go in a safe environment, in a safe container of other men who are also doing it right, so you're not alone, oh my goodness, the healing that happens is powerful. It is so powerful and able to walk out, like Jacob did, with a new identity of sorts, a truth from God, that is from scripture, that is also in your heart, that you can live out now.

Chris Grainger: 28:56

Amen. I am really curious for you, though, all the different guys that you've worked with from I'm thinking generationals, from millennials, Gen Z, Gen X, even boomers, and taking this concept of unstuck, are there any common threads that you see from generation to generation? And then, what are some of the newer nuanced things that maybe millennials have faced that no other generation that you have seen as much, or Gen X, or whatever it may be? I'm just curious what are the commonalities and what are the nuanced things for those specific genres and collection of men that you've worked with?

Roy Wooten: 29:42

Yeah, so we are finding the younger, like under 30 or number one, more open to getting away from their devices, which is strange. Like there's that that millennials actually have like fear to give up you know their devices and get, you know, get it get in a space where they're disconnected electronically virtually for a long period of time. And and a Gen Xers a little less so, but still because now they're running their businesses on their phones right Now they're running their businesses wherever they are and so they're afraid to like disconnect for a whole weekend and get real with other men. But these, you know, Gen Z, these younger ones under 30, under 27, they're they are like, oh, I'd like to take a break from technology and they've lived on it their whole life and it's like they're not afraid to be away from it and to connect with real people. So I find that interesting. The other thing that's interesting is the, you know, boomers are and we have fewer and fewer coming. You know we've got some that come in their 70s, but they're aging more and more. They've lived their whole life with more secrecy. For the most part, they've lived their whole life with more secrecy. For the most part, they've lived their whole life with more secrecy. And so the thing.

Roy Wooten: 31:11

You know, I remember a church leader I think it was a deacon at his church. He just refused to do anything, almost anything that they asked him to do Certainly never teach or say a prayer in public or whatever. And he came on the weekend and whenever it came time for him to kind of wrestle with God around his stuff, he told a story about being, I think he was 10. And he used to go like with a quarter to watch the movie on Sunday the matinee and some of the other boys older boys, boys in the balcony and they called him up and he thought it was cool to get to be with them and then they sexually abused him. He had never told that story.

Roy Wooten: 32:00

He's in his 70s, never told that story, and he had been living out of a shameful place that not only God could never forgive him, which is just a lie. There's nothing that you've ever done or has ever been done to you that God doesn't forgive you for. And so he went through that experience. But also, living out of the shame, he just felt unworthy around all the other people. He thought he was the only one and that he had to figure it out on his own. This man walked out of there and started giving testimonials in public at church. His church leadership moved considerably because he got healing around that incident in his life that Satan used powerfully to keep him out of the leadership in the church and leadership in general. So, from the young to the old, the series of exercises seem to be working on whatever issue that they bring, and we've worked with service, active service and veterans. We've worked with people who've been through big T traumas, you know, and and small, you know.

Chris Grainger: 33:20

Seriously. I mean the, the tax on marriage. It seems like it's just it's at an all-time high right now. So in your events, are you seeing some commonalities there? Obviously, pornography, you've already mentioned that earlier. But what are you seeing and how are you seeing some of these guys move past towards healing in those areas, because I'm sure we're the evil ones trying to steal, kill and destroy every one of our marriages out here. So I'm just curious from your expertise and your experiences, what's the feedback from the field?

Roy Wooten: 33:54

Yeah, if I'm living in a place of identity challenge around those lies that Satan's given me and I feel like I'm the only one and I've got to figure it out on my own, then I'm living alone and isolated so much so that I'm easier to be taken out with things. You know the ways that men numb themselves from the pain, the ways that men run and hide the way Jacob did, and pornography is one. You know affairs and buying sex, but also like being so much into individual sports that they're like isolated from their family. Working workaholism, like working all the time just to stay away from the conflict in the home, like working all the time just to stay away from the conflict in the home.

Roy Wooten: 34:47

You know there are a lot of things that are behaviors that get in the way, and I think part of the reason why we feel like we've got to figure it out on our own is the way that we are acculturated today as boys.

Roy Wooten: 35:02

So as boys, I don't know if you experienced this, chris, but somewhere along the way somebody said boy, don don't know if you experienced this, chris, but somewhere along the way somebody said boy, don't you cry when you let a tear out, you maybe showed some fear in the gym class or the other boys made fun of you. So you decided any show of weakness or any way that I actually express my emotions I've got to be, not ever do so. We stuff them and we hide them, et cetera. And what's breaking that happens through the weekend is that men find that they can actually trust and be real and authentic with other men so that they can not try to get their strength from women, but through the sharpening each other in their connections with men and small groups and small meetups they are able to carry strength into their relationship so that they're not coming to their wife with neediness but coming to their wife with strength.

Chris Grainger: 36:18

That's great, that is wonderful. Well, I mean, as we I've worked with groups like this in the past as well Sometimes a big hurdle that guys have is actually being vulnerable. So how do you get them past that to where they can just be? You've already mentioned the word authentic, which I love, but that vulnerability is a big piece as well. When you throw those two words out to some guys, they're going to turn 180 and go the other direction. So how do you encourage them to just not don't do that about face and to start leaning in it?

Roy Wooten: 36:55

is scary. To take the thing that I really believe is true about me that if I shared it with anyone, if anyone knew it, then they would abandon me, reject me, kick me out, et cetera Then to step forward in courage and to own that in front of another. That's a very scary thing. And James says there's healing in that right, james 5.16,. There's healing in that right, james 5.16, there's healing when you confess, when you confess to one another not only the sins that you've done, but also the sins that have been done to you. So I really believe that the reason that we get men there so fast is because we have. You know, this is an event. This is not an event where you have a speaker or a speaker or two who are giving out knowledge and, you know, sometimes even setting themselves up to be, you know, be like me kind of. You know, I've got it all together. This is not a weekend like that. This is a weekend where somewhere around 20, 25 different teachers will teach and they're all men who have gone through our weekend and they've gone through the hard parts themselves and now they're coming back to help other men kind of get through. They're fighting for the hearts of the men that are coming through. And so we do it by example, like the teacher isn't saying do it like me as far as, like I've got it all together. They're saying I also have stuff in my life and here's what I got going on. That kind of authenticity, the research on shame says breeds authenticity. In other words, when someone goes first, vulnerability actually is magnetic and draws people to you and gives permission for other men to be real themselves. So we have a sign that doesn't sound very Christian, but we have a sign at our retreat that says it's just got two letters B and the letter S and it's got a big no cross through it. And we're just like be real, come on, be real.

Roy Wooten: 39:19

Jesus lived in such a way that was authentic and real. Right, he walked around with the men in his life and those that followed him and talked about all kinds of things in life, like, hey, guys, you know, I know you want to be first and second and third, but you know the first will be last. He was challenging to them. He wasn't like a passive leader. He wasn't a Christian. Good boy, nice boy. He wouldn't have been crucified if he was, because they crucified people who were dangerous.

Roy Wooten: 39:55

So Jesus really stepped into the courage in his life. He stood between a mob who was going to, between a mob who was going to throw rocks and kill a woman who had been caught doing something wrong, committing adultery. He stood between them and put a barrier there. He stepped in to cleanse and turn tables at the temple, not out of like I'm angry and I pop, but he fashioned a whip. It says so that had to take some time. He did it methodically and no one got hurt. We don't have any record that anyone got hurt in that.

Roy Wooten: 40:33

We heard some businesses, but people and, and over and over again he does the hard thing. He has real conversations with those around him. He tells Peter, someone he really loves look, it's going to get tough and you're going to say you don't even know who I am. He tells him that he doesn't hide back from that fact. He tells him that. But then he does this incredible restoration of him on the other side of his resurrection, where he sits with his buddy and he says look, do you love me? Do you know me? Can we restore this? He does the hard things over and over again.

Roy Wooten: 41:16

That is a man of courage, not a man of acquiescing to the world, that is, a man of assertiveness, not a man who's passive in his world and he's not all bowed up with muscles and tats and with a big truck and trying to show and prove I'm masculine. He is masculine in a way that shows courage but also is safe for all the women around him. Women felt safe around him to come with him, to be in him and follow him and to be the disciples of his and children were drawn to him. He was a man that children were drawn to, just as he went about life. So when we look at Jesus, we can see some ways that we should be as men.

Chris Grainger: 42:08

Yes, amen to that, amen to that. Well, this has been phenomenal. Roy, if you wouldn't mind, we'd love to play a lightning round with you towards the end and just to kind of get to know you a little bit more, and so we'll dive right into that.

Roy Wooten: 42:23

Well, let me make sure people know they can get a free copy of my book and get a daily devotional the devotional you know that I told you I write called Compass Resources. At our website it's called thecrucibleprojectorg and they go down there and give us their name and email address and I'll be in their inbox every week and they'll get a free copy of the book.

Chris Grainger: 42:48

That's awesome. Now, was that a daily, devotional or weekly? I can't remember what you said.

Roy Wooten: 42:51

I'm sorry, weekly yes.

Chris Grainger: 42:53

Weekly. Okay, all right, so we'll make sure that links in the show notes for you guys. So we'll jump right into the lightning round, roy.

Roy Wooten: 43:11

So what's something that you enjoy doing for fun? You got any hobbies that you that you that you enjoy For forever, like being in nature, hiking, fishing has been my thing, but two years ago God blessed us with a grandson and he's my number one favorite thing to do. Like just to be with him, play with him, you know, get him out in the world and have some of his first, the first time he ever fished, the first time he had an ice cream cone. You know I was teaching him how to roll up and down the windows. I'm sure my daughter and her husband are going to be really frustrated about that, you know, in a vehicle, but it is such a joy to have a grand, a grandchild.

Chris Grainger: 43:40

Amen to that Amen. It sounds like he's close by as well.

Roy Wooten: 43:44

Yeah, yeah.

Chris Grainger: 43:45

Yeah, you get this. He's going to be a spoiled little dude. That's awesome. That's awesome. Now you're in Texas, so what's? What's your go-to food?

Roy Wooten: 43:54

Oh man, tacos and enchiladas. You know it's got to be Tex-Mex. I like a good steak and all that, but you know I have a. I built this body by eating tacos and enchiladas. Right, and the problem is I think I have a taco addiction and there's a dealer on every corner here in San Antonio, so they are so good and they're everywhere and, yeah, I've got to pace myself and how many I eat and how frequently I eat them.

Chris Grainger: 44:28

What's a myth about Texas that you want to debunk? I mean, since you are out of Texas, a lot of people have these thoughts about Texas. What's something that you like to debunk here?

Roy Wooten: 44:40

Oh, so that's a scary question. You know I was in Australia. We do weekends in Australia, both the East and West coast, and usually people when they meet me if they're the first time they've ever met a Tex they wonder if we have horses. Everybody has horses. How many times I've been shot at, you know? They wonder about gun violence. They wonder you know stuff like that. Well, I don't feel unsafe anywhere I go here. I feel safe in Texas and there are ranchers and cattle and horses, but the majority of people living in Texas don't have anything to do with those industries. The other thing I would say is we are similar to most states where the urban centers lean one direction and the rural Texas leans another. So that's pretty common. But there's this like real, you know, individualist, we can do it, we're going to figure it out, you know. And pride in the state of Texas for Texans, and I wish Americans loved America as much as Texans love Texas.

Chris Grainger: 45:50

Amen to that, amen. Well, let's do a fun one. So superpowers there's all these superhero movies and things out there. Royce, if you could have a superpower, which one would you choose and how would you use it?

Roy Wooten: 46:04

Hmm, Wow, you know I mean what, what? What went first in my mind too, was those tacos. Like if I could eat all the tacos I wanted and lose weight, that would be it. You know, that's a billion dollar, that's a billion dollar product, right there.

Roy Wooten: 46:22

You know, I don't know. I think I think if I could be in service and in mission and and still always be with family, that would be the best. I travel a bit for my job, of course, and I love family. I love my son and daughter and grandson and all of my in-laws and my wife, yeah, so it's just a blessing. I think if I could do that, that would be what I would do.

Chris Grainger: 46:53

Love it, Love it. What do you think about God Roy? What is your favorite thing about him?

Roy Wooten: 47:00

Love it, love it. What do you think about God, roy? What is your favorite thing about him? He knows me and everything about me, and even things that I might not even fully know about myself, and he still loves me and I bring him pleasure. The psalmist says so that blows me away. The love that he has, not just for me but for everyone, that he pursues us, that he is after us, that he wants to be in relationship with us. And he wrote the book not as a book of rules, but kind of like the owner's manual of this is what's helpful and good for you. Right, do it this way and life will be good for you. And if you don't, it'll be hard for life to be good for you. And so to think about a God who's just pursuing me at that pace and that he loves people that I even have trouble loving, and that he loves people that I even have trouble loving, it just blows me away. Love it.

Chris Grainger: 48:02

Love it. Let's flip it 180, Roy.

Roy Wooten: 48:09

What's your least favorite thing about the evil one? How he can take truth even from a pulpit and just twist it just a little bit. A pulpit, and just twist it just a little bit. That allows predators to hurt people who are new in their faith, like the number of pastors who are blowing up their ministries with moral failings breaks my heart and there's a part of me that's like if Crucible could have just got to them. You know, a year earlier, six months earlier, we could have prevented this. And then we see so many who come through our weekends who have church wounds or pastor wounds from things that are just horrible, horrible to mention. You know that they've lived through. Yeah, and I believe Satan's at work with isolating pastors and making them feel like, you know, they don't need any accountability or they don't need other men in their lives, and so that he can take them out and in doing so, sometimes taking out some really innocent people along the way.

Chris Grainger: 49:26

Yeah, 100%. Well, roy, this has been great. The last question for you is what do you hope that the listeners remember the most from our conversation today?

Roy Wooten: 49:35

Yeah, get unstuck, man. The thing that you're afraid to do to be all that God's called you to be. Just take action, garner your courage and move in the direction, even though you're afraid. Move in that direction and just watch. God bless you as you go.

Chris Grainger: 49:57

Amen, Amen. One more time. Point them to your URL. Where do you want to send them? To connect with you and the wonderful things you're doing?

Roy Wooten: 50:04

Yes, thecrucibleprojectorg, we're also on all the social media channels, so but, thecrucibleprojectorg, go down and fill out the form for Compass and we'll send you a copy of my book for free.

Chris Grainger: 50:18

Awesome, awesome, roy, thank you so much. It's been an honor to have you on sir.

Roy Wooten: 50:22

You bet. God bless you, Chris.

Chris Grainger: 50:27

Most men are fighting battles. No one sees Strain marriages, silent wounds, pressure to lead without a place to rest. That's why we created our community to help build, strength, sharpen and support brothers just like you. And now it's even easier to join than ever. We've lowered access to just $15.99 a month. Immediately, you'll get our daily spiritual kickoffs, our Bible studies, lion Lunches, friday Forge and so much more. Every man needs a stronghold and you don't have to fight alone.

Chris Grainger: 51:00

Join today at thelionwithinus that's thelionwithinus and get started today. All right, fellas, I told you that was going to be a good one. So I'm so thankful for Roy for joining us. Just a good time, just to unpack, just to hear his heart and how he's really out there serving in a meaningful way.

Chris Grainger: 51:20

The question of the week this week is who helps carry your burdens when life feels overwhelming? Let's just be real Life can feel overwhelming. Quite often you got to have some people in your corner that are going to come alongside. They're going to help carry those burdens. So it's not just drowning you, just holding you down. So, guys, if you need support, if you need encouragement in that area, I implore you to go to thelionwithinus. Check out our resources, check out our community. It could be a great way to connect with some guys that are going to come alongside you right now Prayer warriors, just guys to talk to, guys to be real, transparent, authentic, with right there at the line with Dennis.

Chris Grainger: 52:03

Ok, we also have our, our leadership mastermind. So if you want to take it to the next level, to where you actually can start forming deep, deep relationships and having meaningful conversations and getting salient advice, not from the world, but biblical advice, the Leadership Mastermind is where it's at. So, again, all those resources are found at thelionwithinus. So, guys, give us a rating, give us a review. If you want to support the show, click on the donate button. That would be wonderful as well. Other than that, we'll see you on our fun Friday episode. So, thanks so much for listening. Guys, have a great day and just keep on leashing the lion within.