Chris Grainger: 1:10

Welcome to the Lion Within Us, a podcast serving Christian men who are hungry to be the leaders God intends you to be. I'm your host, chris Granger. Let's jump in. All right, guys, it's your meat episode. Let's get right into it, okay? So the scripture of the week this week is 1 Thessalonians 5, verses 16 through 18. It says Rejoice always, pray continually. Give to the spiritual kickoff episode. If you want a really good boost for your day. Get your week started right. Try to give that each and every Monday on our spiritual kickoff episodes that come out each week. Now, the cool part is we actually do a spiritual kickoff every day within our community at the Lion Within Us, and if you kind of feel like maybe throughout your week, things just start lacking and you're drifting and you're missing something, lots of guys find tons of enjoyment in this guys. So I go live every morning in our community. It's a great way to engage. If you can't make it directly live, the postings are exclusive for our community members. So, again, the lionwithinus to check out all those resources there.

Chris Grainger: 2:16

Ok, so we're going to have a fun conversation today. This is going to be super exciting. So, richard Gamble he's coming in and he is the visionary leader behind this massive project called the Eternal Wall. Ok, so this is going to be a public piece of of art revealing how Jesus has answered millions of prayers. So this is a going to be a massive database of hope and stories that are impacting across the world. So this idea of Richard's going to walk us through how he got the idea in 2004 and the plan he's he's walked ever since just to get it to where it's at right now. So this is pretty exciting.

Chris Grainger: 2:56

Richard's a great guy. He studied at Bible College, he worked for the British Gash, then he left the big corporate world to really lean into entrepreneurship, as he has a software business, a marketing business, and he loves football. We may call it soccer, but he's from the UK, he calls it football and he's got lots of fun things he's going to talk about. I thoroughly enjoyed the conversation with Richard. I think this is going to be something that you guys really enjoy as well, and it's just exciting for us on the front end of a project like this to be able to see where it goes next. So I encourage you to sit back, enjoy this fun conversation with my friend, richard Gabel. Well, Richard, welcome to the Lion Within Us. How are you doing today?

Richard Gamble: 3:41

Yeah, doing very well. Thank you, doing very well. We've actually got blue sky in England today, which is a bit of a rarity, so that's good.

Chris Grainger: 3:48

See, the Lion is international International, that's it. So lion is international international, that's it's so exciting. The listeners probably quickly picked up that you're not from north carolina, so yeah, where is home at? For?

Richard Gamble: 3:59

you. So, uh, I live in leicester, which is about 90 miles north of london, in the center of the country, okay very good, very good.

Chris Grainger: 4:07

Well, give us something before we dive into what we're gonna be looking at today. Give us something fun we dive into what we're going to be looking at today. Give us something fun about you that maybe not many people know about.

Richard Gamble: 4:17

Well, I used to be a sports chaplain for Leicester City Football Club, but only when they were rubbish. They became like world famous because they they won the top prize, the Premier League, a few years ago, but unfortunately I was there before that. So maybe laying a foundation, but maybe not.

Chris Grainger: 4:39

That's right. No, your work definitely contributed to it, richard, don't cut yourself short, right.

Richard Gamble: 4:44

Let's hope so.

Chris Grainger: 4:45

That's it. Well, I know when they reached out about the topic, I was like this is pretty interesting and I love just to kind of get your insight around the Genesis behind the idea of the eternal wall of answered prayers and how you even came up with it. Just kind of get us to where you're at.

Richard Gamble: 5:03

Yeah, sure, so it was in 2004. So 20, 21 years ago, I was carrying a cross around my county. I wanted people to think about Jesus during Easter and the idea was just to create this almost like performance art, so people would think about Jesus as they were driving into work and it started to get a lot of traction. And it started to get a lot of traction and one of the things that happened was my father, who's not a Christian, was in a governmental meeting like 40 miles away, and in the middle of this governmental meeting, somebody said to him. Somebody said just in the middle of the meeting, I saw a really weird thing. Today I saw this guy in a suit carrying a cross. What's all that about? And my father went. Well, that was my son and, even though he's not a Christian, my father then shared the gospel with the whole room this is what my son believes, which was amazing, and I just picked, started picking up all these different conversations that were happening.

Richard Gamble: 6:11

So one day I was carrying this sort of 70 miles and just one of the days, I prayed and I said, well, god, what do you want me to do next? And this sort of vision idea flashed through my head to build a wall by the side of the motorway made of a million bricks, and so I sort of went home with a little twinkle in my eye. My wife was like, hey, what's going on? I was like I think we're going to build a monument about Jesus, uh, so I didn't really know what to do. Then, you know, that was the idea, and so I had 10 years just praying about it, thinking about it, not knowing to start. I'm not a practical guy in any shape or form. And then it was 10 years ago when God finally said right, I need you to get this started.

Chris Grainger: 7:00

Okay, wow. So I mean from literally carrying the cross. That's when the original seed was planted.

Richard Gamble: 7:09

Yeah, wow, seed was planted. Yeah, yeah, because, um, you know, we we live in a society in the uk where christianity has very much been put on mute and, you know, easter has just become a celebration of chocolate. I wanted people to to think about the, the Jesus that it was about, and nine years later I had two people come up to me and say they got saved just by seeing the cross. They didn't even come and talk to me while I was carrying it, but just by seeing the cross just had an impact on them and they gave their life to Christ.

Chris Grainger: 7:46

I'm super interested now. You said your dad wasn't a believer. Obviously you have this strong conviction, so take us back a little bit earlier. So how did you you know your point of salvation, because I mean, usually the dad in the home sets the pace and the temperature for spirituality and things like that. So the fact that he wasn't. I'm super curious on how you and what's your personal story there?

Richard Gamble: 8:11

yeah, so that? So the story? Is this really? Um, I, my, my nan, my grandma, taught me how to listen to conversations in the room next door by putting a glass up against the wall. She taught you this?

Richard Gamble: 8:28

she taught me that cool grandma, and so I uh thought I'll give that a go when I get home. And I put the glass up against the wall and I heard my mum talking to my dad that she may have to go in for tests for cancer. And I didn't know how to pray or what to do, but I just knelt by my bed. Neither my mum nor dad do, but I just knelt by my bed. Neither my mum nor dad are Christians. I just knelt by my bed at the age of 11 years old and just said God, can you look after my mum for me?

Richard Gamble: 9:03

And I felt in that moment really difficult to describe, but I felt like a hand around me and just felt this sense of it was going to be, it was going to be OK, which it was, which it was.

Richard Gamble: 9:18

And so from that point, at 11, I believed in God, but I didn't know what to do with that. And it took another nine years till somebody shared the gospel with me and I was invited to go to a church. And while I was in this church, I'm watching people worshipping and I'm thinking, huh, this is real to them. And then I felt that same experience of God being with me, that hand, which I now know is the presence of God, right, and so I was like, ok, and it just sort of flicked a switch in me where I thought, I sort of thought that God was up there in the clouds, he was going to give us a thumbs up or a thumbs down after we died, you know. And it, just as a 20 year old man, I thought, huh, god wants to be involved in my life now. And, uh, I just I gave my life to Christ. That was it.

Chris Grainger: 10:21

What a great story. So so who was it that shared the God? Was it a friend who shared the gospel?

Richard Gamble: 10:26

So this, this, this guy came up to me at church who I didn't know and just said, you know, talked to me and said, hey, do you want to come to the pub tonight? I was like, yeah, sure, took me to the pub and just shared the gospel with me and I didn't need persuading, I didn't, it wasn't, it was like a straightforward decision. I was like right, yeah, you know sort of where do I sign, how do I get, how do I get on this? Right, yeah, you know sort of where do I sign, how do I get, how do I get on this? You know, I and I think, chris, that has been a motivating force for me that god had already done the work. He just wanted somebody to be faithful to, to share the gospel with me. And I suppose part of me, though very thankful to that guy, was like hey, why did I have to wait nine years for someone to share the gospel with me?

Chris Grainger: 11:13

how was the response from your parents?

Richard Gamble: 11:15

uh, I think they were a little bit concerned in the beginning, you know, concerned that maybe I've joined a cult or something because I was. I was, uh, a little wayward. I think it'd be fair to say, and um, so they so it to say, and so it was a significant life change for me. But then after time they started to see that it was a good thing for me. And then, I think, after about three, four years I think, my brother, who's 12 years my younger, he gave his life to Christ too, and we're both still walking with God.

Chris Grainger: 11:55

Now was he still living at home.

Richard Gamble: 11:58

At that point. Yes, he was.

Chris Grainger: 12:00

Yeah, yeah, okay, so you brought him along, so he was watching Big Brother a lot, that's right, yeah, yeah, still is.

Richard Gamble: 12:07

He's got a lot to learn, you know, that's right.

Chris Grainger: 12:18

That's right, that's right. Well, big brother's always the best, because I'm a big brother too, so you know anyway. Well, that's incredible. I mean what? What a testimony for for for you and for others? Because it sounds like, I mean, definitely in the uk christianity is not pervasive everywhere. I mean it's accepted, but it sounds like there's lots of secular type of worldview thinking.

Richard Gamble: 12:32

Yeah, absolutely. But what I would say is you know, we are seeing the beginnings of revival in this country. You know there are pockets now of revival happenings that's the only way I can describe it. Revival happenings, that's the only way I can describe it. In my, in the church that I'm part of in leicester, we've seen 474 young people saved in in a year. I predominantly sort of you know, sort of 15 to 25 year olds, okay, you know. And that actually that story is replicated amongst a number of churches, not across the board in the country. I wouldn't, I wouldn't say that, but we are certainly seeing pockets of revival.

Richard Gamble: 13:24

And then you're hearing these stories that are coming out and obviously, with the eternal war, which we'll talk about in a bit, I love, I love stories of answer prayer and I'll share one that I heard just two days ago in the context of sharing some amazing things that were happening. And there was there was a pastor who saw an advert for an event called Awaken and he went up to it and thought, oh, that looks like a Christian event. That's sort of a Christian title, isn't it? Awaken? But as he read the pamphlet it was about it was like an occult festival. So he took it down, he pinned it on his fridge door and he committed to pray for it every day, Right, he pinned it on his fridge door and he committed to pray for it every day, Right.

Richard Gamble: 14:14

And then there's this lady who was at risk of losing her children and she was in a court meeting and the father was. They'd been divorced, the father was looking to take the children away from her and her mother had given her a cross at the start of the day and she said hey, I don't believe in that sort of stuff. And her mum said look, just take it with you. And in the meeting, in this court meeting, she had no money for anybody to represent her. And so the meeting started and she realised she was going to lose and she put her hand in her pocket and she held the cross and just said Jesus, if you're there, help me.

Richard Gamble: 14:57

And just within the court, then this woman stood up in a suit with loads of papers and said I'm here to represent this client. And she just got up, walked forward, stood next to the lady, and the lady had no idea how. She had all the details, but she basically won the case for her. So this lady then goes OK, well, Jesus has answered my prayer and she decides to. She goes to a church happens to be where this pastor has been praying and goes to the church and says, what do I do to become a Christian? And tells him the story and then, as he's talking it through with her, she went huh, I'm probably going to have to give up my business. And he was like well, what's your business? Because I run an occult festival called awaken.

Chris Grainger: 15:48

Oh bro.

Richard Gamble: 15:49

Oh, cool Is that that is awesome so.

Richard Gamble: 15:54

So we're sort of seeing these things, seeing these things more and more, I think. Uh, another, another story that I heard at the weekend of a, a girl who went to get her tarot cards read and that the tarot card death came up, and then she said she saw in the on the tarot card evidently I don't know this stuff, but there's there's like a tombstone, but it has a cross on it and she saw jesus come out of the cross and she just gave her life to christ. I mean, these are like you know, with these things you sort of often hear talked about in the Middle East, that's not happening in the UK. Now, god's hand is firm and I think God's had enough and we're starting to see some real change, which is exciting. Don't believe what you hear on the press, is my message.

Chris Grainger: 16:48

Amen, brother. How has that impacted your family, since, I mean, it sounds like you've been walking with the Lord for a while. Your parents, did they ever listen to the gospel? Just, I'm sure that's.

Richard Gamble: 17:00

I mean it's, it's, I mean it's a good, good question. My, my, my mom and dad, they're very proud of what I'm doing. Yeah, they would say that they follow God in their own way, but, you know, I'm still to see the salvation that I'd like to see from them. Let's put it that way. But keep praying for them and we'll see. But my wife's Christian. I've got three kids and two of them are going on with God. One of them is not so sure at the moment, but you just got to keep praying for them, you know.

Chris Grainger: 17:37

Amen, brother, amen. Well, let's take our first break, guys. We'll be right back. We'll keep digging in.

Chris Grainger: 17:42

With Richard, I've got something big to share. We're making a major shift because we know the battle was real and it's time more men had access to the support they need. For too long, guys have been trying to carry the weight alone pressure at work, tension at home, wounds from the past and a world that demands strength but offers no place to rest. We see it, we've lived it, and that's exactly why we built our community. It's a stronghold, a place where warriors can find rest, truth and a band of brothers standing beside them. And starting now, we're making it easier than ever to step in. We've lowered the barrier to just $15.99 a month. That means, for less than the cost of a drive-thru lunch, you can join a brotherhood that's centered on Christ and built for growth. Inside you'll find access to our daily spiritual kickoffs every Monday through Friday, our Lion Lunches, our Bible Studies, our Friday Forge Gatherings all that and so much more.

Chris Grainger: 18:39

Every man needs a stronghold, and you don't have to fight alone. If you've been waiting for the right time to jump in, this is it. Go to thelionwithinus and join the community and see for yourself what happens when iron truly sharpens. Iron, richard, I mean, it sounds like you know some incredible things. Obviously Super excited to unpack everything with the internal wall of answer prayer. So how do you choose the place, like, where is this going to be built? At once, you start doing that. Walk us through that.

Richard Gamble: 19:13

Well, the place is the story story how we chose the place, because that place is my answer to that. Okay, so I went to, uh, I, I, uh it was about two, I think it was about 2014, 2015 and somehow, and I, 2014, 2015. And somehow and I don't know how I get myself into these situations, but somehow I managed to. I'm presenting this in Parliament, this idea of a national monument, and I've got members of Parliament, sort of like Congress equivalent. I've then got members of the House of the Lords Senate equivalent, and members of the national press and they're quizzing me about this vision, about this idea. And one of them says hey, you know, this is a great vision, but how are you going to fund this?

Richard Gamble: 20:06

And at the time, I had £5 in the bank. And I said to them well, you know, I've got a really big funder behind me and, uh, obviously, for you and your listeners, you know that that's the one who owns a thousand cows on a thousand Hills. Uh, fortunately, they didn't go up for the follow-up question of who that big funder is. I think they just thought of different people it could be. And then I just I just thought, yeah, man, I need to, uh, I need to get the land now.

Chris Grainger: 20:37

I need to find the land.

Richard Gamble: 20:39

And we got invited to go to a um, a church in california, okay, and so nobody knew who we were or what we were doing. And we were at this church in North California and somebody comes up to us and she says, oh, because at that point I'm like we need land. That's got to be the next step. And then this lady came up to us she didn't know us, she'd not overheard us talking or anything like that and she said I've got a word from god for you. I'm like, okay, and she said god wants you to know. He's got some heavenly land for you. So I'm like that's really cool to go over the you know one side of the planet and got to you about something that nobody else knows. What's going on in your head, right, right. So I then I then tell my team and we've got a team of people praying all the time and I tell my team hey, listen, this is what god said.

Richard Gamble: 21:42

And I was about to pay a company to look at all the potential uh, portions of land by motorways in the united Kingdom. And this lady said well, I'm just going to. If God said he's got some land, I'm just going to ask him where it is. She said that'll save us a lot of time, won't it? I was like yeah go for it.

Richard Gamble: 22:09

And so then she just sends me an email with a, with a google map with a circle around the map, and says either this is the land or the person who owns this land is really significant for the project. What she didn't know was the person who owned that land had emailed me just two days before.

Chris Grainger: 22:32

Oh, come on bro.

Richard Gamble: 22:33

Yeah. So I then meet with this guy and I'm pitching my heart out, you know, and just trying to, and he's, you know, your typical businessman. They don't give away anything, do they, you know? And he's, he's he's sort of stony-faced. I'm sharing him, sharing with him everything. And he's like when did god speak to you? I was like god spoke to me in 2004. And at the end of the meeting he then tells me that god spoke to him the same vision in 2003 okay, pretty cool man yeah, so.

Richard Gamble: 23:13

So he then says well, I'm going to go away and pray about whether we can give you some land and I.

Richard Gamble: 23:20

But I hadn't told him about the woman circling the land because I didn't want to manipulate the conversation right, you know sometimes people throw in the god bomb god's told me to do this and it just puts other people in in difficult position. So, um, so, basically, then, uh, he goes away, comes back, says, hey, we've decided to give you some land, but it wasn't the piece that was circled. Now, now, I didn't mind, I was happy I've got a piece of land by motorway. It's worth a million pounds. I'm delighted. The lady who's praying is going. This is not the piece I circled. I'm like come on, let's just be happy.

Richard Gamble: 23:56

Anyway, after six months he phones me up and he says man, I'm really sorry, I can't give you that land. I'll have to give you another piece of land. He gives me another piece of land, still not the one that was circled. Another six months goes past and that land doesn't work. And then his father says to him listen, I've met loads of people who tell me that God's told him to do something. But I do believe this guy, I do believe Rich and I don't want to be the man who had the chance to give him land and pass it by. So give him the best piece of land. So he paid an architect to look at all the land that he owns in the united kingdom and, of course, the architect came back with a piece that the woman had circled.

Richard Gamble: 24:44

So I think things like that, obviously that's that's a story where god is all over it. It's taken, took a lot of patience, but but I think the times on the journey when you're like, oh my word, they've been. They've been a number of times when the whole thing's hung in the balance and and on those times you go back to that story and you go, wow, god's on this, it's okay, and I suppose that's part of the principle of what we're doing is, if you remember what God has done in your life, if you remember the stories of the things that he's done, it gives you strength to have hope as you look to the future.

Chris Grainger: 25:26

Now. So we have the land. Obviously, god had his hand all in that. What about the actual design of the work? Did he give you that as well? What did that?

Richard Gamble: 25:39

come from. So we ran a competition with the Royal Institute of British Architects a global competition to get it designed. We needed to raise the money for that, and even the raising of the money was miraculous. We needed to raise forty, five thousand and forty days through a crowd funder. We had only half the money with four days to go.

Richard Gamble: 26:04

I went, prayed through the night on a hill. I had a God encounter. God spoke to me and said you know, my job was to lead in peace. So I had two days really wrestling with God, trying to find peace, and what I realized in those two days was God was really saying look, this is not your project, this is mine. Stop striving, just let me do what I tell you to do, but let me be God. And so on the second day, when I found that piece, then all the rest of the money flooded in in 24 hours. It was incredible. And so then we were able to do the competition.

Richard Gamble: 26:44

It was an anonymous competition, so we had 120, I think it was 125 entries, no, 133 entries from 25 countries based in the UK, and he basically said that he felt the Holy Spirit give him the design. He designed it in five minutes, wow. So he just felt like God just downloaded it to him and he created it, which is so. The winning design is a giant white Mobius strip, a giant white infinity loop, and it reaches sort of 50 metres into the skyline. 50 metres that would. You can get the if you take the Statue of Liberty off her plinth, then she would fit underneath that to give you an idea of size. And it's made of a million bricks and every brick represents a story of answered prayer, a testimony where people are prayed to Jesus and you can see how he's answered. The concept is that people can take their phone, point it at the structure and their phone lights up and it tells them the story of Answer Prayer that that brick represents Wow.

Chris Grainger: 28:10

Okay, so there's a big technology component to it as well Massive technology component yeah, it sounds like just the architecture itself, the design to pull that off with bricks. That's some significant weight and that's a beautiful design. So lots of planning goes into pulling that off, I'm sure.

Richard Gamble: 28:32

Yeah, it's been again. It's interesting when you look back, because I've been on it 20 years and at times you go why has God asked me to do this? I think naivety is a big part of it. To be honest, I think if I knew what engineers know, I wouldn't have got very far, you know. I'd have given up, right, but just naively going. Do you know what? This is? What God's told me to do, and we're going to do it. And certainly the structure is pushing the boundaries of engineering it really is and um, so we've had to have some of the world's best engineers working out how it's going to stay up.

Richard Gamble: 29:15

I was in a wind tunnel, uh, just the last few days, where that we were testing that this thing could survive a 700 year storm right once, 700 yearyear storm because it's got unique pressures. But the vision is to build something that's truly iconic. So I think you have to do something. That's difficult, because this is not, as I see it, a United Kingdom vision, because if you look at something like Christ the Redeemer in Rio de Janeiro, it's a world-known landmark, right, but if you Google Christ the Redeemer, you don't find anything about Jesus. You find out about a French bloke who built it. But the idea with Eternal Wall is, if you Google it, you're going to find a database of a million stories of answer prayer. We hope that people. We expect over 30 million Googles a year and so we hope that those 30 million people are going to find stories that inspire them to find the God who answers. So it's very much a global vision.

Chris Grainger: 30:31

Well, speak to the technology piece too. I'm just super curious because it sounds like the bricks, the individual bricks, are going to have specific prayers, but you mentioned being able to pull your phone up. Where is that at in the planning right now?

Richard Gamble: 30:44

so far as is looking at the technology component, so, um, so the way that it will work is that the we won't have any technology on the structure. Okay, so the technology is all in the app, gotcha. So the app works, works out where you're standing, where you're, the angle your phone is. Therefore, it shows you the, the bricks that you're pointing your phone at, okay, and then you can choose the brick to read. Okay, you'll tap a digital brick, if you like on the phone, right, what you're looking at, and then, either in written word or audio or video, you'll then be able to download the testimony Wow, okay, and you'll be able to search through. So if loneliness is an issue for you, or maybe you're suffering from an incurable disease, you could type in that disease and then the app will then show you all the people who've had that disease. The doctors have been curable, but they prayed to jesus and this is how he's answered so what?

Chris Grainger: 31:57

the project as it stands right now. Has anything been broken on the ground, on the land, or where is that at?

Richard Gamble: 32:04

yeah, I know, because it's such a huge project and so crazy like is this ever going to happen? But I can tell you we've got loads of great news. So we have our um, our planning permission, our zoning permission.

Richard Gamble: 32:17

Okay which as you can imagine, in a country like the united kingdom, where you can lose your job for wearing a cross, to get planning permission for an unashamedly Christian landmark is miraculous, to say the least. So we have that planning permission. We've built a mile-long road to get us to the actual portion of land, and we are just a few weeks away now from signing our contract, and so we should be beginning building at some point this year. We're opening in 2027. Okay, we've raised the money for the monument. We still need to raise the money for car park technology and visitor center. Okay, but we are well on our way. Well on our way, which is exciting.

Richard Gamble: 33:18

That is exciting.

Chris Grainger: 33:19

Man, that's exciting. So, guys, we're going to take our second break. We'll be right back. Fellas, we're making a big change that I think you're really going to enjoy.

Chris Grainger: 33:30

I spent a lot of time thinking about our spiritual kickoffs and, honestly, I love doing them each week, so much so we started doing them live every Monday through Friday inside our exclusive platform, and here's the best part we decided to give full access, completely free, so now you can join our daily spiritual kickoff space at no cost. Every day, we go live to read the word, to encourage each other and find simple and powerful ways to apply God's truth to our lives. You'll even have the chance to engage with me directly, and if you missed a live stream, don't worry. The videos are posted the same day so you can catch up whenever it works for you. This is exclusive behind-the-scenes content that is not available anywhere else, and now we've removed every excuse. So if you're ready to get started, head over to thelionwithinS and grab your free access today. Let's grow together. So, richard, you mentioned that you've raised the money, so how does fundraising look for something like that? Are you guys going out? Is there any you?

Chris Grainger: 34:43

know, I guess guess government provided funds for this or just all sourced independently?

Richard Gamble: 34:49

uh, it's, it's uh, no government funding whatsoever, um, and I think that's right because, um, without government funding, there's no ties on what you can say and what you can't say I think it's important that we're independent, um, and yeah, we've just had a a roller coaster journey of god providing for us just the right money just at the right time.

Richard Gamble: 35:15

We've had over 20 000 people so far have backed the project and it's been, it's been really incredible. It's not easy and obviously we've had to raise money through COVID, raise money through, raise money through you know, living cost crisis that followed and rumors of World War III. I read a great scripture just this weekend. It says those who it's in Jeremiah 17. Scripture just this weekend it says those who it's in jeremiah 17 and it basically says those who trust and have confidence in him. I'll paraphrase it you're in good shape, you don't fear when the heat comes on and you don't worry when the drought comes, and, um, god's provision for us has been incredible. I'll I'll tell you a story that we've had, just as an example.

Richard Gamble: 36:08

We were, um, I was trying to get the planning permission, so I was really working hard and I have to be honest, I think most christian leaders in the united kingdom were like that's a lovely idea, but you are never getting planning permission. And um, so I said to my team listen, how much money do we need to pay the staff this month. And they told me the number and I was like, right, okay, that's a big number. And I was like, look, guys, I'm sorry, but I've got to concentrate on the planning. You need to raise the money. And they're like, yeah, okay, we'll do that.

Richard Gamble: 36:43

So halfway through the month, how are we getting on, guys, same number that it was at the beginning. I'm like, hmm, okay, a week to go, how are we getting on Same number? We get to the end of the month, I'm like, how are we doing? They said, yeah, we've not raised any. But they said I said, well, when do we need the money? By they went. Well, the good news is we don't need the money until first thing, monday morning. So we're going to pray over the weekend.

Richard Gamble: 37:10

And I sort of loved their faith, you know.

Richard Gamble: 37:12

It was like, oh okay, so they go away and pray. This guy, who has no knowledge of the situation that we're in, is on his bicycle on a Saturday morning cycling along and he feels the Holy Spirit say you need to give some money to Eternal War. And he gets off his bike and he's about to transfer it on his app and then he feels the Holy Spirit say no, don't send it till first thing Monday morning. And the amount that he sent covered the staff that we needed and it came in five minutes before we needed to pay out, and so it was just. I think.

Richard Gamble: 37:52

I think what's interesting is that God, in those situations of need, it just causes you to draw on him more and more and really go deep with him. And I think that's a great privilege of the journey that you become so intimate because you're so dependent on him. And that's the way it's been with the finance. That's the way it is today. You know I have financial needs today because we have things in. I don't know whether you have it in the States, but in the UK we have things called restricted funding. So we've got restricted funding for the monument, which is great, but we can't use any of that money to use on staff and other elements. So we're still hand to mouth. But God is good, he's always been good and he just moves people's heart to provide just at the right time.

Chris Grainger: 38:46

Man, it just sounds like I always say a lot of times on the show God's timing is perfect. He's just rarely early.

Richard Gamble: 38:55

Well, you know, there's a guy called George Muller who I think it was in the 19, oh I don't know. It was either late 1800s or early 1900s and he basically built a site to feed, like children and the poor, and he would just pray. He never asked anybody for money, he would just pray and they always got what they needed. But what's interesting when you read through his journal is that he always says I need this money in the next three weeks and the money never comes in the next three weeks.

Richard Gamble: 39:48

It always comes just a little bit later and I think, you know, I don't think God's particularly on time, and my friend and I have often discussed that, and I think it's because the more we're dependent on him, the closer we get to him and I think his timing is perfect. His timing is perfect. One of the things that I've learned is that I think our responsibility as Christians, in whatever God's called us to do, we are responsible for the rhythm of God in our lives. We're responsible. You know, galatians talks about keeping in step with the Spirit and I believe that as we walk with God the amount that we read the word and pray and fellowship and all those things they keep our rhythm. But the timing of God is his responsibility and the challenge comes when we try and take that timing and make it our responsibility and then we push and we strive and we stress and then that takes us out of our own rhythm. So rhythm of God is our responsibility, timing of God is his responsibility.

Chris Grainger: 41:03

Beautifully said. So walk me through. Let's go ahead and get to the finish line where you have this monument built. Obviously, god's moving these things. It's going to happen. Walk me through the experience that you hope. Maybe a young man or a couple, husband and wife. What are they going to feel? What are they going to do? What do you hope that? The emotions they go through when they turn a corner, they see the eternal law of prayer for the first time. Yeah, what are you hoping to invoke there?

Richard Gamble: 41:37

Yeah, great question.

Richard Gamble: 41:39

Well, I've got two stories. So my number one is I'm imagining a wife and a husband who've just been to hospital and they've just been given a diagnosis and their world has just fallen apart. And they're driving home and they see these signs for the eternal wall of answer prayer. And they see it and they go let's just go there. And then they type their diagnosis into the app and the app shows them. They put their phone up and they start to read stories. They realize that they're not alone, they're not the only people that have been in that situation, and they realize that there's hope For us. We want to make hope visible and so we trust that they find a story that they can relate to and then we trust that that's the beginning of their journey to find the god of answers. My other, my other example is of a teenage girl in Peru who's doing her school project looking at landmarks, and she goes, oh, look at this eternal wall. And she Googles it or she digitally searches it, and then she finds this database and then she types in Peru. She wants to see if there are any stories from Peru, and sure enough, there they are, and she realizes that the God who's in the UK is the same God who, where she lives and she gives her life to Christ, and the year is 2089. And to me, those are two different stories of the experiences.

Richard Gamble: 43:29

I want people to find hope, to not believe the lies. We have loads of facts thrown at us from the media and from all different sources. Facts are one thing, but truth is another, and truth should always override facts, because facts change, and, um, we saw that in covid. I mean, the facts were all over the place, weren't they? You know so, but the truth, the truth, remains unchanged. God is for us. Who can be against us? And so we hope that they find the truth of christ, christ, and find that hope and give their lives to him. And in that respect, I believe, because we're building something that's going to last over 100 years, it's one of the biggest evangelist opportunities this world has ever seen.

Chris Grainger: 44:21

The stories. You've mentioned those several times already. Where are the stories generated from? How do you get those? How? That's going to be part of it, Because that is the pivotal part of this and share their stories with us.

Richard Gamble: 44:42

There's no limit of how many stories they can share, okay, and we're just asking them to go to the website eternalwallorguk and, either written, video or audio, tell us your stories, tell us what God has done. Some of those stories are big stories, the wow moments. You know, I was healed from ankylosing spondylitis, for example, just moving out the sun. We don't normally have this problem in the UK. I was healed of ankylosing spondylitis. You know that's one of my stories.

Richard Gamble: 45:16

But I don't want to. I don't want us to represent a God that just does the wow stories. I want to represent the whole range. You know, sometimes we have to wait for God to answer. We've talked about that already. Sometimes God answers in a way that we weren't expecting, in a different way from what we were asking. And you know what? Sometimes the answer's no and sometimes in those answers we find great comfort and support from God through our pain and suffering. So what we're not trying to present is a supermarket God where we get exactly what we want. We're asking people to share the stories that show, and have a thread through them, that this is about relationship. Have a thread through them that this is about relationship. You know, I think God is more interested about relationship than answer prayer, and the journey of answer prayer is all about just finding more about him. So we're just asking people from all over the world send us your stories.

Chris Grainger: 46:28

Let us know what God's done in your life. That's incredible. So what's been the most fulfilling part of this project so far for you?

Richard Gamble: 46:39

I think there was a moment when we were getting the planning, when I was just going for a walk, praying, and I just had a moment where I just felt the favor of God. I just felt that he was pleased, pleased with what I was doing, imperfect as it is, and you know, in that respect it's just a privilege to serve um. It's a great joy, though, when you see your vision start to get outworked before we've even started building. We had a guy. I'll give you a couple of stories I managed to. I had a meeting in number 10 Downing Street talking about the project. The guy, one of the advisors to the prime minister, told me that his wife and him were struggling to have kids. I sent him some stories of answer prayer about people who'd struggled to have kids and told him, encouraged them to read through those stories and pray that the same God that answered those stories for those couples would answer them for him and his wife. And nine months later he submitted his story of answered prayer on the wall.

Chris Grainger: 48:04

There you go.

Richard Gamble: 48:05

I had another guy who, six months ago, he'd been fighting it for ages, but he was like I've got to stop. He was suffering from chronic fatigue syndrome and he was, you know, really really ill, ill. I did the same thing to him, I sent him stories and, uh, in december he emailed me and said that the stories had gave him, given him hope. He prayed, he read them through regularly, prayed through them regularly and, uh, you know, 2025 is back to work.

Chris Grainger: 48:41

Amen Amen.

Richard Gamble: 48:44

And I do believe, chris, that I do believe in the power of testimony. I do believe that when you share a testimony, it gives somebody the hope that it can happen for them. It changes the atmosphere for that miracle to happen again them. It changes the atmosphere for that miracle to happen again. And so, if you understand the power of testimony, we're going to be releasing millions of testimonies over the globe for hundreds of years. That's got to forward the kingdom of God in our lifetimes, hasn't it? Amen, brother.

Chris Grainger: 49:21

Man powerful't it? Amen, brother man, powerful, powerful stuff there, rich. So let's take our last break, guys, we'll be right back. Life can feel heavy and too often we try to carry it alone. At the Lion Within Us, we build a Christ-centered community where you can go, connect, grow and be encouraged by brothers who get it. And now joining is easier than ever. We've lowered access to just $15.99 a month. Inside you'll unlock our daily spiritual kickoffs, our Bible studies, lion Lunches, friday Forge and, most importantly, a space to be real. Remember, every man needs a stronghold and you don't have to fight alone.

Chris Grainger: 50:06

To get started, visit thelionwithinus. We'd love to welcome you in. That's thelionwithinus, I'll see you inside. So Rich this has been. I'm so excited for this project. I'm looking forward to following it along for sure. Before we wrap up today, we always like to have some fun with our guests and do a lightning round, just a quick lightning round at the end. So we'll park the project for now. We'll come back at the end and share some more as we go, but if you're willing to play, we'll jump right in.

Richard Gamble: 50:38

Yeah, I'm nervous now, but go for it.

Chris Grainger: 50:45

No, it's good stuff, it's good. I haven't lost a patient yet, so we're good to go, you know so. So what's what's your favorite hobby?

Richard Gamble: 50:49

what's something that you enjoy doing for fun? Uh, I love watching football, um, and so, uh, my son and I go and watch football. I'm not loving it this year because our team is absolute rubbish. A soccer, I would say actually for to translate our team. Is it this year because our team is absolute rubbish. A soccer, I would say actually to translate. Our team is rubbish this year. But, yeah, always a good thing to shout at a football pitch. You get it out of the system, don't you?

Chris Grainger: 51:13

There you go, so you go to your son. You said to a lot of them. How old is he?

Richard Gamble: 51:19

So he's 15.

Chris Grainger: 51:20

Okay.

Richard Gamble: 51:22

And gave his life to Christ six months ago.

Chris Grainger: 51:25

Oh wow, oh, wow, okay. So you said you had three kids, three kids, yeah, so son's 23. 23.

Richard Gamble: 51:34

And daughter's 21.

Chris Grainger: 51:37

Okay, all right, well, enjoy that time with them for sure. What about your favorite favorite food? What's your go-to there?

Richard Gamble: 51:44

rich oh, my wife makes a raspberry and lemon roulade.

Chris Grainger: 51:51

Okay they're like folded.

Richard Gamble: 51:54

Folded meringue uh-huh and uh, so that would be the pudding. The fact that I've started with pudding first or dessert first tells you everything.

Chris Grainger: 52:04

A little sweet tooth there.

Richard Gamble: 52:06

Yeah, but then chicken fajitas, I think would be my go-to meal.

Chris Grainger: 52:11

There you go, there you go. Okay, good stuff. So if you could have a superpower, which one would it be and how would you use it?

Richard Gamble: 52:22

Oh man, I would like to go forward in time very selfishly, because I know this is going to get done. I'd like to fast forward through some of the pain at times or maybe go back and go. Don't do that, mate. That's going to cause you all sorts of hassle right right yeah, time travel would would uh say that. I mean you. You know, it's through the, uh, it's through the, the perseverance, isn't it that that?

Richard Gamble: 52:55

forms like right so I mustn't wish that away, but I mean, even even at the weekend I was like if I could take a pill and wake up in June, I would be a happy man.

Chris Grainger: 53:10

Well, how about we always like to share truth here? Is there anything that you're currently struggling with right now or working through?

Richard Gamble: 53:20

or working through. I think it's an ongoing the challenge of waiting at times.

Chris Grainger: 53:30

Oh.

Richard Gamble: 53:31

When you it doesn't. You know the word talks a lot about waiting on God. It doesn't tell you how to wait. I think or it's not clear, I certainly can't find the preaching about it but that when you're in that realm of, and there are a couple of items for me at the moment where there's literally nothing I can do, I've literally got to make a choice.

Richard Gamble: 54:09

Am I going to believe God for this, or am I not? And that is when I say it doesn't get easier. I think obviously you learn, and you learn levels to that, but the challenges get bigger and bigger and the ramifications get bigger and bigger.

Chris Grainger: 54:25

Right.

Richard Gamble: 54:27

And, um, just, it's just really that raw I would call it raw faith of. I can't affect the outcome. All I can do is choose to believe. And then how do I choose, like I shared in that scripture from Jeremiah, to trust and have confidence in him, not have confidence in the enemy, not have confidence in man, just trust, to just have my confidence in him. Because if I can do that, I can give Worry a bit of a beating 100%, brother, 100%.

Chris Grainger: 55:09

When you look at the last year, where did you spend too much time?

Richard Gamble: 55:16

Oh, where have I spent too much time in the last year? I have probably been on my phone too much. I am really I mean, I've deleted my social media off my phone Really, yeah, and trying not to. I think we just have an overload of information in modern society and the news. I used to be a real news junkie, but I've tried to stop that as well, because I'm like this is affecting my soul. You know, this is affecting my mood, and though, on the one hand, I'm passionate about politics and impacts on people's lives all over the world, but on the other hand, I've got to do what God has called me to do.

Chris Grainger: 56:14

Sure.

Richard Gamble: 56:15

Focus on what he's called me to do. So that's, you know, in the last year that's one of the things both my wife and I, we just went. I saw some stats on social media me to do. And so that's, you know, in the last year that's one of the things both my wife and I, we just went, I saw some stats on social media. I'm like this is not good. This is, this is modern day tobacco and in years to come I think generations will look back on us and go, oh my, word what they, what were they doing?

Richard Gamble: 56:37

yeah, yeah, you know, we're just in, we're in overload territory and uh. So in, in putting that aside, I'm trying to do more thinking. I'm trying to have more time where my head is not full even of music or even of any you know any distraction and just like, do you know what? Just gonna clear my mind, see where God takes me.

Chris Grainger: 57:02

That's right. It's hard just to be still and to be quiet and the phones have rewired that we feel that quiet time with distraction and noise.

Richard Gamble: 57:15

Yeah, I love watching the Alone series.

Chris Grainger: 57:19

Have you come across that they where they?

Richard Gamble: 57:21

um, they're like living the the arctic for like 100 days or try and survive off the land okay and it's the one thing I you know I'd be rubbish at it, you know, because I like my mcdonald's and stuff like that but but the peace that they have and the simplicity of life I find incredibly attractive.

Chris Grainger: 57:42

Oh yeah, oh yeah, absolutely Every weekend. We have a farm here in North Carolina, so what I like the most about it is on Saturdays. Usually it's a day I just do the most work on the farm. I don't have good cell phone coverage, so I'm literally unplugged for you know hours, 12 hours, and it's uh, I don't miss it.

Richard Gamble: 58:04

I don't miss it yeah, wonderful, wonderful, well I'm. I'm not carrying my phone around with me all the time now, just leaving it places as well there you go, there you go.

Chris Grainger: 58:14

Well, how about you know? I'd love to get your opinion on this. What's your favorite thing about god, and when you think about him, what's it? What's the favorite thing that comes to mind?

Richard Gamble: 58:25

I think, um, I love that, he understands me. I love that. Um, you know, I I'll give you an example. Not that I love that, he loves me, he understands me, he knows everything about me. He still loves me.

Richard Gamble: 58:49

I'm like you know, sometimes because I'm a little bit ADHD and I'll be in worship and my mind is I'm like one minute I'm in deep worship. The next minute I might be thinking about the soccer results, or you know, what am I eating in an hour? Or what socks have I got on? And I remember once in worship going oh Jesus, I am so sorry, my head's all over the place. I just thought Jesus clearly said to me that's what I love about you. I just thought Jesus clearly said to me that's what I love about you, and just that sort of acceptance for who we are. I really love that.

Richard Gamble: 59:38

I think the other thing that I love about God is he is the king of strategy. He is the king of strategy. He is the king. And you know, right now a lot of people would say that this world's gone to hell in a handcart, and I think Jesus is letting that. I got the strategy, I know where we're going, that's it. I know where we're going. And just when the enemy thinks I've got this nailed, then all of a sudden, and uh, uk being a good example. I think a lot of people thought, well, the uk's gone to the dogs. But I tell you, we're seeing revival in this nation. It's, it's gonna happen amen to that.

Chris Grainger: 1:00:15

Now let's flip it 180. What's your least favorite thing of the evil one?

Richard Gamble: 1:00:26

I don't, I haven't really thought about that, to be honest. I mean, I just think he's a pain and an irritant, um, and I, just I, I try, I don't, I don't, I don't think I can answer that because I don't, I don't think I particularly think like that. Um, he's lost. There you go, there's a, there's a, there's a. Uh, one of my favorite scriptures is they overcame by the blood of the lamb and the word of the testimony. Now he's stuffed on the blood of the lamb. It's a done deal.

Richard Gamble: 1:01:24

But I suppose my least favorite thing is the way that he tries to put the church on mute, to mute the testimony. And if you look at some of the things that have happened, there are multiple strategies to try and shut the church up and stop the church from telling their story and we have to be wise to that and some of them are very subtle, like political correctness. If that's if the spirit of political correctness seeps into the church, then somebody gets healed from cancer and somebody says, oh, yeah, but let's not celebrate that because you know, joe has got cancer and he's going to feel bad that he didn't get healed. Well, that's completely contrary to Scripture, that's a lie, that's right.

Richard Gamble: 1:02:05

Scripture says when one part of the body is honored, we're all honored. Scripture says proclaim the deeds of the Lord over and over again. So yeah, we're not going to allow the church to be on mute. The testimony is the way that we overcome.

Chris Grainger: 1:02:22

Amen, brother, Amen. The last question for you is what do you hope the listeners remember the most from our conversation today?

Richard Gamble: 1:02:32

I hope that they remember that last bit actually, that actually you have within your kit bag the equipment to overcome, and throughout the Bible there are stories of how they remembered what God had done and whatever challenge in life you've got, you can get those stories out and they remind you that God is with you, god is for you and he's a God who doesn't change. So use that testimony to overcome for his glory.

Chris Grainger: 1:03:10

Amen, amen, brother. Well, look where do you want to point the listeners to learn more about you, maybe connect with you as well as the Eternal Wall Prayer, just to try to direct them in the right areas.

Richard Gamble: 1:03:22

Yeah, so please come to eternalwallorguk. We would love to hear your stories. If God moves you to donate, that would be awesome too. There you go. But first and foremost, we need stories. We need volunteers to help us dig up some of the stories from the history to put on the wall as well. Uh, and then you can follow us on social media.

Richard Gamble: 1:03:52

I won't be, I won't be looking at it, as you know, but, uh, we're on all. We're on your Facebook, x and LinkedIn, all of those things, instagram, et cetera. But I would say this to you and to your listeners You've got the opportunity to be part of something. Don't be someone who just steps back and watches from afar. Be part of it. Watches from afar, be part of it, because here's the beauty is, you can tell your grandchildren hey, I got, I got a brick in that wall, right. Let me tell you what jesus has done in my life, and it's a great way for you to share your story and pass it out down the generations, like it talks about in deuteronomy man amen, don't be sideline participants here, let's jump in and be active.

Chris Grainger: 1:04:45

So it's just been great. Thank you so much for sharing it. Anything else you'd like to touch on today?

Richard Gamble: 1:04:50

No great God bless you all in North Carolina there you go. I'd be there in a heartbeat if I could. And yeah, god bless you, and the world is in an interesting place, if I could. And yeah, god bless you, and it's. The world is in an interesting place, but our God has a master strategy and it's going to be good.

Chris Grainger: 1:05:09

Amen, brother, amen. Well, you have a wonderful day. Thank you again.

Richard Gamble: 1:05:13

Bless you, god bless, bye-bye.

Chris Grainger: 1:05:18

Most men are fighting battles. No one sees Strain marriages, silent wounds, pressure to lead without a place to rest. That's why we created our community To help build, strength, sharpen and support brothers just like you. And now it's even easier to join than ever. We've lowered access to just $15.99 a month. Immediately, you'll get our daily spiritual kickoffs, our Bible studies, lion Lunches, friday Forge and so much more. Every man needs a stronghold and you don't have to fight alone.

Chris Grainger: 1:05:51

Join today at thelionwithinus that's thelionwithinus and get started today. All right, guys, I told you it was going to be a great one. Hopefully you enjoyed that one with Richard. Go, make sure you check out the links as well and head over to the Eternal Wall. Get plugged in. If you have a story of impact or of hope or encouragement, why would you not want to just get plugged in right now and be part of what he's building, okay? So the question of the week this week is really focused on how do you rejoice when life gets hard and rejoicing when things get hard Sometimes. A great way to do that is through the testimony of others and encouragement of others, and this is a great example, a great tie to what Richard talked about today directly for you to see that firsthand. So maybe you could be. The stories that you've gone through could be that story of hope that someone needs to hear, and this is a beautiful way to share. Okay, so, guys, thanks again so much for listening. Give us a rating and review.

Chris Grainger: 1:06:53

Head over to the lion withinus. That's the lion withinus. All our resources, the Bible app, all the different ways we help from our summit leadership development. We're really leaning in to help you grow, be the leader that god intends you to be. Guys, we have tons and tons of resources, tons of so much content out there. It's just it's it's everywhere, but definitely it's all collected right there at the lion withinus. So add it to your favorite browser tabs and all that stuff. Come back to it often. We're changing stuff on a consistent basis, updating it, trying to give you more and more resources to help you in your journey. All right, so have a great day. Get after it, fellas. Thank you so much for listening. Come back on Friday for our Fun Friday episode. We're going to unpack some good things there together and keep unleashing the lion within.